Orient

[Sgt Frag]

Red and Blu have set up shop in the orient and now must spy on each other and gather intel.

B3 released
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk59/Schwaa1147/ctf_orient_b3_red.jpg

B2
Added animated model doors to main spawns, didn't have time to do all of them.
Added custom objects (oriental lamp, bridge, supports, spawn doors)
Changed some texturing and added signs to make path more clear to intel.
Added a side door to temples, to cave entrance. May add doors to optimize
and give cover.
Tried more light bounces to lessen darkness in caves.
Cleaned up displacements to help player pathing/optimizing.
Moved Vault door back for room.
Replaced brush stairs with models and clipped stairs.
Added sprites.
Still waiting for compile to finish.
Fixed menu photos.
Fixed sombrero tex so spies could cloak. Added pink elephant pinyata to gibs.
(turn on bday mode before map loads)
Optimized.
Added indoor sounds to temple/spawns.
Lowered balcony so it's eaasier to jump.
Adjusted rain particles.
Added ctf_gamerules entities so map will eventually stalemate.
Tied water to cubemaps.
Shave 10MB off raw file with lightmap scale on brushes that didn't
gather shadows.
Probably more...

>>>REALLY need feedback on the new side door.
I might add sliding doors to help optimize it, but I think it'll be good for engies to set up in waterfall area quickly. Also help to defend attack back of bases.


--------------------------------
ctf_orient_b1a
DOH! forgot to change 4 spawn points from blu to red.. Fixed
forgot a player clip in red giving advantage vantage point. Fixed


ctf_orient_b1 Now on TF2Maps.net server (when the forum changed I couldn't figure out how to upload here anymore :P lol)

added second spawn
touched up lights
added tunnel under water fall
got rid of a water fall
cleaned up displacements
added ammo health
optimized
deleted all dynamic fps sucking lights
rain waterfall particles and sound
proper sprites
player clip


issues:
still working on skybox, a couple nodraw/skybox errors
add more sounds
tweak lighting
more details



ctf_orient_a2

Went and changed the name. decided it would be best to have a regular linear style instead of circular, more action, whatnot.
As it's not in the shape of a yin yang anymore I thought Orient might be more fitting.

Alot of displacement work, rocks, caves, under water.


ctf_yin_yang
by OR!g!NAL (aka Sgt Frag)

-Edit - 5- 20-09

updated to a2

made some pretty substanstial outdoor area size changes, shrunk it down
and changed the outside paths so players had to be in the open more.

no build in intel building. Hopefully that will cure the engie turtling ;)
plenty of spots to build outside.

fixed all spawn issues

failed at cubemaps and menu photos, no time.

got rid of middle path.




-EDIT- 5-17-09

added ctf_yin_yang_a1

blocked in the gameplay area. have alot to do detail wise, but looking for gameplay comments.

http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/95668
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk59/Schwaa1147/yin_yang_test_120002.jpg
--------
Currently I have the base layout figured out. I'll post shot later but it is basically shaped like it's namesake, the Yin Yang.

Red and Blu each have a 'territory', one yin, the other yang. Basically each teams ground is a teardrop shape.
Their base (shown in the pics) is the dot in the teardrop.

There will be four exits/entrances into the other teams territory. They will be fairly evenly distributed along the middle of the teardrops. The closer the entrance is to the other teams base the harder it will be to gain access to, the entrances furthest from the base will be easier to enter enemy territory through, but once inside you will need to cover more ground in unfriendly territory.

The bases will be small and fairly open to hopefully stop turtling within the base itself and instead bring the battle into the outside territories.

Currently the blue base is almost finished, a few details need to be added yet and the inside areas need pinned down.

There will be 2 spawns, one away from the base a bit and the other possibly in a corner of the base but only exiting to the outside.

Here are a couple shots of red color tests. I think I am leaning towards the older version.
recent test
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk59/Schwaa1147/yin_yang_redtest.jpg
old test
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk59/Schwaa1147/yin_yang_redtest_old.jpg

[Owlruler]

Oh my god, thats amazing!

I want it!

[Vander]

Impressive architecture.

[Shadow Monkey]

OMGWTFBBQ!

Holy shit! This is fuckin' amazing!

I want it, too!

[Zeewier]

Looks a bit like cp_japan, but already a lot better detailed :)

[laghlagh]

Damn I wish you would apply for mapper at PVKII and make the asia-themed map I was always hoping for.

It looks excellent and the gameplay sounds cool too.

[uma plata]

Dude, freakin sweet!

Looks very authentic, but also very TF2

New official theme go go go!

[Sgt Frag]

Thanks.

I've been trying to be really meticulous about this one. Mitering all the corners and optimizing as much as possible.
The roofs started a 5 brush curves, now they are 3 brush displacements. Some of the porch/wall trims became objects. I had alot of t-junctions in the func_detail trim on the walls, figured out how to optimize them AND get more detail at the same time (tut to follow) :)

cp_japan was a bit of an inspiration, always thought it was cool visually. But I googled a ton to try and stay away from cloning it. I guess I'm ending up with a japanese/chinese/american amaglam.

What is PVKII Notoorjus?

[laghlagh]

Thanks.

I've been trying to be really meticulous about this one. Mitering all the corners and optimizing as much as possible.
The roofs started a 5 brush curves, now they are 3 brush displacements. Some of the porch/wall trims became objects. I had alot of t-junctions in the func_detail trim on the walls, figured out how to optimize them AND get more detail at the same time (tut to follow) :)

cp_japan was a bit of an inspiration, always thought it was cool visually. But I googled a ton to try and stay away from cloning it. I guess I'm ending up with a japanese/chinese/american amaglam.

What is PVKII Notoorjus?

It's a mod, Pirates, Vikings and Knights. (http://www.pvkii.com/)
I've been playing it a lot lately, and it really has some great maps, but I was always hoping for one with a more asia-themed look. And if you'd be seriously interested, they ARE actually looking for mappers/environmental artists.

I wouldn't worry about it being too similar to cp_japan, it looks way better already.

[Sgt Frag]

added a few screens, zip file first post.

blocked out gameplay area. alpha with tex. looking for gameplay feedback.

[StoneFrog]

http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/59281845/1276150

[FreeLance_FoX]

Yes yes yes yes yes!!!! I've been waiting for someone to create an Asian theme like this for such a long time! I've always had a special place in my heart for cp_japan, and this just looks absolutely fantastic! Those of you who hang out in the chatrooms have probably heard me crooning over a particular sketch:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_sU7XPiqn5dI/SaIkVT5XhOI/AAAAAAAAAUA/pmksa_eGX5c/s400/yoltsketch.jpg

I loved this image as soon as I saw it and envisioned it within the TF2 world immediately. If you do in fact create an interior, I dearly hope it looks like that! :P So far it just looks amazing!

Best of luck,
FoXy

[Fireman]

Some feedback from earlier today on the Cc server:

Beam clipping through wall in spawn
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10000.jpg

I don't know if these were nodrawed, or there were just no pillars added, but the floating roof was just weird, even for an alpha
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10001.jpg

May not be obvious from the pic, but there were some instances of walls clipping through the bottom of doorways
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10002.jpg

This room, leading up to the BLU intel, was as dark as anything, my playermodel actually disappeared at one point
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10003.jpg

My friend and I locked down the intel room pretty well with a sentry here...
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10004.jpg

and here
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q139/groundhogdae/ctf_yin_yang_a10006.jpg

Also, if you'd notice he was able to build directly ON TOP of the intel, pretty much screwing over anyone trying to run in and snatch it. A sentry per doorway proved a pretty good strategy, since there was no real way for the other team to effectively attack them without getting torn apart by either one.

Random bug that may or may not be related to the map, when standing next to my dispenser, myself and other teammates would randomly be launched into the air, and then drop down again, no idea wtf that was.

Also, as a scout I fell into the water while running away, and couldn't get back out. The sides were too high to be able to just jump out of the pools.

I'd really advocate sizing down the map, as of right now it just felt way too big, and most of the fighting took place away from the intel, in the map's common areas. Also, the other team was able to get to our spawn pretty easily, making building teleporters impossible.

[Sgt Frag]

Thanks for the feedback Fireman. Always appreciated.

All of that stuff is gonna/already has changed. I know there were some rough details, I just wanted to get a quick gameplay round in to determine where the map needs to go before I detail it all, like those beams in spawn, not even sure if that building will be that style later (it actually HAD round beams which I changed to square but forgot a few - the ones you see)

The play areas outside have shrunk a bit.

The dark one way rooms have been changed so you don't exit by spawn (until in game with others I really hadn't realized how close that actually was). It was a quick addition at the end but was deffintaly a wrong choice.

I will add no build zone around intel. In fact I am thinking of making the entire base a nobuild zone. I was hoping to not have turtling engies, but on the first test the intel room was locked down almost immediately, so I guess its gonna have to be forced.
But there will be alot more places outside for good sentry placements.

What I really want is for the outside areas to be thought more of as the team bases so people fight outside and try to stop the team from getting into/out of their base.

Also with shrinking it down and adding more nooks it should now be better for spies.

The dispenser thing I have no idea, I wish I would've seen it. Never heard of it and don't know why it would happen.

Oh, and the bridge has been changed. I knew it was a little odd to have no pillars, I just threw it up in a few seconds so it would be closer to the final product so the test.

I'm also fixing the spawn room issue today.

[captainAngry]

Played this last night. Posted feedback on my forum.

It seems like a really nice map but the bases need to be more defined and the outiside area of the map needs to be scaled down.

http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/banner.php?map=ctf_yin_yang_a1&color=blue (http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/#ctf_yin_yang_a1)

[DaFatCat]

Sexy.

[Sgt Frag]

Thanks.

I've fixed all the issues that came up in the first alpha for a2 on sat gameday. The list is in my first post.
--------------
As for issues I know of for gameday.

Spawn doors are are all double. I need to make a trigger open them, right now they are open on touch and it's easy to open one and bump into the other.
Not exploitable but a little annoying.

lighting- Some areas are a bit bright + white tex + HDR = burnt retinas. I suggest turning off hdr for it, it'll be a little more freindly in a few areas. I don't even know why I bothered with hdr anyway.

cubemaps. I failed in the process, it was late, still had to upload and work in the morning. using mat_specular 0 in the console will get rid of all purple except on the water.

no draw - 'holes', etc... Alot of detailing has been done to base, but not finished and the spawn building detailing will probably change. So there are corners that stick out, etc... that have no draw. Nothing major. Also the roof displacement ridges will have objects to cap the ends, right now they have the same 'hole effect'

map description/menu photos. It was late, I was killing myself not figuring out why they didn't work. Probably because they had 'ctf' in the name DOH!
Basically it tells you:
Go out the front or back of you base to reach enemies intel.
There are some signs and arrows but it's basically a big circle with a base at each side.
(2 fort would be a straight line with base at each side).
There are only 2 paths to take with minor side paths that are for cover so it shouldn't be confusing.

AND, I forgot to put a resupply cabnet in the spawn building, although the spawn room in the intel buildings do have functional cabinets and they are close by. There are also 8 med health and ammo packs around the perimeter of the map.

-------------------------
Oh, another weird issue that popped up. probably because I thought the menu photo issue was because of an extra underscore in name yin_yang, I changed the name to yinyang.
So my custom models all of a sudden showed up as white wireframe, something I've never seen before in game but have heard of once a few days ago.
So the trims on the patios might look weird, not sure if they'll block bullets or not, but they'd only block some anyway. And it's alpha so...

[Termaximus]

Got a chance to play today. Fun map overall. The exterior detail on buildings is great, can't wait to see this thing further along.

Others have said this, but definitely need to use triggers to open doors, rather than touch.

Nice work so far overall.

[Sgt Frag]

I appologize to everyone for the failed map upload. Major props to Shmitz for uplaoding and testing at last moment and everyone that stuck around and played both versions.
-------------------------------

Things I got from gameplay that need fixed.

red supply doesn't work :(
cubemaps
hdr
water a bit tough to get out of still
doors need trigger set-up
props wireframe
info screen not worky
forgot supply cabs in back spawn buidling
----------------------------
Issues that were brought up that concern me in a major way.

* problem 1Right now there are 2 paths. One out of front, one out of back to enemy base.
The issue was that if someone on the far side of the map had your intel you couldn't stop them.

This was intentional, but I don't know if it'll work or not.

I want to have a quicker paced, non-turtle map. The 2 paths seem to help somewhat because you have to fight through fewer people in either direction. The map went several rounds and it didn't seem like either team dominated over the other, and turtling wasn't ever an issue.
However one play test isn't the best guide as to what'll happen when people learn the map.

A solution to this that was brought up would be to mirror the map and have both 'waterfalls' lead to each other and only have one major path.

So my question is
Should I leave 2 paths as it is, or should I change it to one? Should I change to one and get a gameday on it like that first?

* problem 2 is nobuild.
I no built the intel purposely to stop turtling. Obviously during this gametest engies inside the intel room were NOT a problem. And not too many people went engi, maybe because of this? I was hoping engies would be more aggressive outside.
I did a bit and another player did, but that was all the engi action I noticed.
In my mind that's not a bad thing, but what others feel is completely different.

Last test you could build in intel and right away there were 2 sentries in intel and it was locked down. I can change the layout some to help that. But I'm still afraid it would lead to difficulty retrieving intel.

I think those issues go hand in hand.
If I make one path and let engies build I have a standard ctf that I'm afraid would be locked down to easily.
If I leave 2 paths and let engis build I'm afraid of medic teams having a hard time getting there together.
If I do one path and nobuild engies might be able to locked down the path easy, but ubers might be able to break through just fine.

-------------------
Another thing that was brought up was that I should just make a CP map out of it. As is I could probably do a grinder style cap map and put the A and B points at the bottom areas and not have to touch layout much at all. (in theory)

if I did that it might be cool to have a one path version for ctf. Any other CP style would take too much of a work over I think.

[DaFatCat]

Great brushwork/texturing!

[Fearlezz]

Wow, thats really beautiful, keep it up mate! Wait a minute.. is that.. HL2 skybox? Fix that now!

[Sgt Frag]

Thanks. Yeah, that was the stock skybox in those old pics.

But I am now using alpinestorm. Still haven't set up the skybox or tried rain, but I optimized alot so I think rain will be fine.

Someone said it was just an overlay that should really take an fps hit, I'll have to see.

I tried putting in a few dynamic lights (6 total) and was having some buggy issues. Major lag but I had some brushes go bad, no leak but they were screwing up lighting. Also seemed to have bugs with the lights, if I changed settings they wouldn't light, then they would, then they wouldn't. Removed them for now but I gotta figure that out for the caves.

[Termaximus]

Good call on the name change! I look forward to seeing this map progress. You are quite amazing with the complex architecture.

[Loc_n_lol]

I played this map on the calculatedChaos server with a handful of people (about 6vs6, but not quite competitive at all :D). Overall it was fun as capping was doable but stopping the cap was also mangable and we still managed to run into each other in the middle from time to time. I'd say you have a nice map going on though I don't know how that would work with a very populated server.

One thing I found and at least another person pointed out, is that there are too few items in the middle. Since most of the fighting seemed to happen in front of the bases, it needs some health and ammo to prepare right before you can get inside the base and face the likely sentry gun/demoman defending the intel.

Good balance between the classes too, I had fun as a scout, soldier, sniper, demoman and pyro

[captainAngry]

You were on my server? Sorry I missed you Loc.

I just wanted to drop by and post the stats for this map.
http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/banner.php?map=ctf_orient_a2&color=orange (http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/#ctf_orient_a2)

[Sgt Frag]

some progress
http://i277.photobucket.com/albums/kk59/Schwaa1147/ctf_orient_det1.jpg

[Termaximus]

Looking really nice man. Way to use the new waterfall entity. :thumbup1:

[Sgt Frag]

updated to b1a

updated 1st post with info

[Psy]

I really like the look of this. :D

[captainAngry]

As always, feedback for you goes on my forum.

http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/demo/getTheDemo.png (http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/demo/auto-20090616-1825-ctf_orient_b1a.zip)http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/images/viewTheThread.png (http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1566)
http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/banner.php?map=ctf_orient_b1a&color=orange (http://gaming.calculatedchaos.com/ratings/#ctf_orient_b1a)

[LunchBox]

Love the asian theme and the architecture looks great :D

[Kronixx]

just found this today, not sure how serious you think it is but it's a pretty funny hiding place for demo's and soldiers.


1246

[Sgt Frag]

Ah yeah, thanks louiekidd,

I wanted them to access that roof, and it's a good double stickie jump if you get it just right. But I might close it off due to optimizing as much as I can. If not I have to clean up the skybox so you can always get through clean.

I've never seen anyone all the way up top though and have only got through it once in game myself.

[Evang7]

I enjoyed playing on this map. I hope you can get a nice skybox in soon. This was a very surprisingly fun CTF map.

[Ravidge]

gameday:
I Still think this map would look better in a bright setting and some really powerful contrasts between the white and brown (wood).
The rain makes it so very depressing :/
The indoors are also very poorly lit (as in 'not bright') and contributes the the overall droopy atmosphere.

Suprisingly hard to play sniper (with rifle) on this map, the ground is bumpy, rocks everywhere, the windows aren't overlooking enough to be useful, the slanted rooves is impossible to strafe-aim on. Even so, there were a bunch of huntsmen running around having fun :P

The water is a pain to battle in, if you try to backpedal away from ppl you are sure to get stuck on small ledges that you have to jump over to get out of the water.

[Sir Jake]

This is a very good map, everyone seems to love it on our servers. Keep up the good work.

[Muffin Man]

This map is great, I played it for the first time on gameday. It's very fun, but could use some changes to improve movement. Especially the roofs. It's really hard to jump onto the balcony from the roof of the base, and jumping from one side to another on the bridge is a pain.

I noticed you have bunch of spectator cameras in the middle of nowhere, just outside your map.

The doors are pretty slow, and one of them (seemed to be more detailed than others) apparently got stuck open sometimes.

[Sgt Frag]

thanks.

The roofs trims are gonna be models most likely, with no collision. Like in the middle of the bridge roof. So it'll be alot easier to get over them, no jumping involved. The bridge is already fixed, just have to get to the main buildings trims.

I've noticed the balcony issue myself. Nobody pointed it out but now that you have I guess I gotta do something :( lol. I'll probably lower that railing a few units, that should help.

The doors are now an animated model, that gets rid of the sticky issues. I think the amount of brushes involved was just hard for the engine to cope with. Each door was around 12+ brushes. Plus I forgot to include a player clip with that.

[Sgt Frag]

updated to b3.

forgot to speed up doors but they are all models now so at least smooth if not a little slow still.

This update was mainly to seal off the skybox tight and close the mid section to optimize.
Being able to see from waterfall to waterfall kindof killed the framerate.
Still 2 paths through the mid, 2 caves. Now the sniper deck is half size, there is a path out the top, a few hiding spots, and a drop into the middle of each cave.

[Kraftwerk]

Just the THUMBNAIL got my download. YOU sir have done something AMAZING. Very very nice architecture. Now I have no idea how it plays. But Layout looks fine to me :)
Edit: Only one suggestion, In spawn rooms and simmilar areas, instead of makeing the ceiling flat try making it arch up and have support beams going across.

[Spartacus]

Need a quick fix for this, otherwise it looks great.

[Sgt Frag]

Ah thanks. Must've missed packing that up.

It says "no camping without permit" btw. Supposed to let people know its the other teams spawn.